What the Japs did to the Chinese in WW2

kapai · Joined: 10 Feb 2004 Posts: 44

The following is what the Jap biological warfare Unit 731 did to Chinese during World War 2.

- Marutas were infected with typhoid, in order to study the transmission of contagious diseases.
- Marutas were placed inside pressure chambers. They suffered terrible agony as their eyes first popped out of their sockets and blood forced its way out through pores in the skin.
- Marutas were mummified alive in total dehydration experiments. They sweated to death under the heat of hot dry fans. Others were electrocuted or boiled alive.
- Marutas had their blood siphoned off and replaced with the blood of horses in plasma experiments.
- Lightening was induced to strike marutas, and their bodies were studied.
- Marutas were tied to stakes and torn apart by dogs
- Marutas were electrocuted at increasing voltages to see the effect and damage incurred on the body.
- Marutas were put into high-speed centrifuges and spun until dead. Their bodies were then dissected and notes taken about their anatomy and physiology.
- Marutas were exposed to X-rays for long periods of time and their bodily responses recorded.
- The potency and minimum lethal dosages of toxins and their antidotes were tried out on marutas.
- Bullets were shot into the heads of marutas from various angles. The brains were removed and preserved for reference and study.
- Marutas were beaten with various rough objects to observe the kinds of skin and muscle damage.
- Marutas were used to test the effectiveness of firebombs. Marutas were locked into tank cars and firebombs allowed to explode inside. They were burned alive.
- Marutas were used to test the effectiveness of the Japanese army rifles to see how many people the bullet could penetrate. Tests were conducted at various distances and for different types of army uniforms worn.
- Air was injected into the blood vessels of marutas and their organ morphologies observed at various stages through live dissections until death.
- Marutas were hung upside-down until dead. Notes were taken at various times on their organ morphology and physiology by dissection.
- Hot water experiment: Put marutas into hot water and gradually increase the temperature. Study the location and degree of burn as well as the relationship between temperature and survival.

A "maruta" is a live human used for experiments, mainly Chinese prisoners of war, or civilians picked off the street. (Meant “a log of wood” in Japanese)

(excerpts from www.sjwar.org - the Alliance for Preserving the Truth of Sino-Japanese War)
_________________
www.chinesenationalistalliance.org

lyllee · Joined: 04 May 2004 Posts: 12 Location: London

You are sadistic!

What are you trying to say?

malnoh · Joined: 05 Mar 2004 Posts: 42

I think the use of the word 'jap' is considered racist here in the UK.

kapai · Joined: 10 Feb 2004 Posts: 44

lyllee · Joined: 04 May 2004 Posts: 12 Location: London

Well, you could check the dictionary and look up "sadistic" and then come back and ask me a better question. Either that or you really need to get a life!

kapai · Joined: 10 Feb 2004 Posts: 44

GweiLo · Joined: 22 Feb 2004 Posts: 149

kapai,

lyllee does accuse you, rather than what you posted, of being Sadistic.
Definition from dictionary.com is
1) The deriving of sexual gratification or the tendency to derive sexual gratification from inflicting pain or emotional abuse on others.
2) The deriving of pleasure, or the tendency to derive pleasure, from cruelty.
3) Extreme cruelty.

Cruelty is defined at the same source as
4)The quality or condition of being cruel.
5) Something, such as a cruel act or remark, that causes pain or suffering.
6) Law. The infliction of physical or mental distress, especially when considered a determinant in granting a divorce.

I don't think there can be much debate that you have often done No 5, so presumably ltllee thinks you derive pleasure from it...see No2. If you do then the definition is accurate.

I don't see anywhere where lyllee suggests that those individuals who did these things were not sadistic.

As ever you try to turn debates away from the real issue when you are questioned instead of answering the question. In other threads you have supported those that inflict pain and suffering on others. You must realise that in light of your other posts people will draw conclussions about your motivations and aims. You have a theme going on this board which appears to some of us as essentially motivated by racisism.

Like lyllee I am curious as to what you are trying to say....that torture is bad? That the Japanese are bad? What was the point you were trying to make when you posted? That is the question.

unity97 · Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 10

GweiLo · Joined: 22 Feb 2004 Posts: 149

Unity,
I have spent all of my adult life, and much of my childhood, fighting racism so I am not going to stop now. I don't care much what race the perpetrator of racism is, they are going to get grief from me. I don't really care if you like it or not. Whether you like it or not I have an absolute right, and I think a moral obligation, to do it.

Nobody has said that the kapai's statement about the activities of Unit 731 were not honest or factual. I know them to be true as they are well known and well documented, just as, incedentally, are the experiments they carried out on US POW's in Japan of a similar nature.

Nobody has suggested that any of those things should be forgotten by anyone

malnoh · Joined: 05 Mar 2004 Posts: 42

GweiLo · Joined: 22 Feb 2004 Posts: 149

malnoh,
Thanks for your encouragement.

It didn't occur to me that Unity might be another CNA member, but the

unity97 · Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 10

In response to Malnoh and Gweilo, I do not happen to be a member of the CNA. Even if I was, would that in your minds discredit whatever I say? In the same way that, to some people, if a government is considered not to be a democratic one, then everything it does or says can be discredited or dismissed out of hand. In fact I am not a member of any organisation. I prefer to retain the right to have an independent point of view, no matter how unpopular it may be to those who hold different views.

As heavy-handed as the Chinese Communist government is claimed to be, I know of no comparison between their conduct and some of the most inhumane atrocities that the Japanese perpetrated against the Chinese people and allied POW's during their occupation. The Japanese atrocities outlined by Kapai being only one case in point.

As for the system of government in China (as well as that in Taiwan I might add) I am very aware of their negative AND their positive aspects. I always try to take a more balanced view of things and to see the bigger picture. In particular I keep in mind the historical context and the very difficult conditions in which the Chinese government has had to function over the years. The Japanese occupation and aggression was only one of the events in China’s history that has left very damaging legacies on the nation and her people. Others include

- the experience of imperialism and colonisation by Western occupiers, predominantly the British and the Americans;

- the British opium trade and the Opium Wars inflicted on China and her people by the British;

- American interference in the Chinese civil war between the Communists and the Nationalist Party – the most contemptible aspect of which was the Nationalist Party’s active strategy, at the bidding of the Americans, to direct their fight against the Communists rather than against the Japanese occupiers, thereby undermining the resistance efforts of the Communists against the Japanese;

- Chiang Kai Shek and his Nationalist Party's expropriation of all the funds from China’s state treasury when the Party fled to Taiwan, with the aid of the Americans, thereby leaving a war-torn country without the financial resources to rebuild itself or to feed its' billions of people. It seems that as far as the Nationalist Party and the Americans were concerned, the lives of countless innocent people were not too high a price to pay for their ruthless quest to bring down a political ideology they were opposed to.

- America’s involvement in the Korean civil war, thereby drawing China into a war it did not want to take part in. At that time China was still in the process of recovery and nation-building and needed all her manpower and what resources she had for that purpose. When the Americans sent in troops to fight alongside the South Koreans, China was drawn into somebody else’s war in order to protect her national security and borders. The war meant that valuable manpower and resources had to be re-directed into fighting a war that the country did not want. Even though China did not have an air-force at that time, unlike the US, her courageous soldiers held their ground and forced the US to withdraw and to agree to an end to the war.

I am not aware of the number of Korean casualties, but more Chinese soldiers died in that war than in any other war in the country's history. China and her people paid a heavy price for the Korean war, a conflict she was involuntarily drawn into by the Americans. In addition to causing large-scale casualties and human suffering, the war was a major and drastic setback to the country’s social, political and economic development. The North Koreans too paid a high price for the war and are still suffering the consequences today.

It was within this historical context and from these very difficult conditions that the Chinese government had to set about rebuilding the country and providing for its' people, all the time having to maintain its' national security and defend its' borders against hostile nations, in particular the USA, hell-bent on bringing down a political ideology it opposed by whatever means necessary. Nobody can deny that it has been a long and painful process.

Every government in the world should be open to criticism, and China's has received more than its' fair share of criticism and condemnation, some of it deserved, some of it just plain China-bashing or communism/ideology-bashing. Every government is also entitled to praise and acknowledgement for its' achievements and in this respect I do not believe that the Chinese government or the Chinese people have received due credit for what they have overcome and achieved. China and her people have come a long way and there is still much that needs to be done.

Western nations should not forget how their own democratic systems developed. It was a long and drawn-out process which started with the vote being granted only to the upper classes and only later on were other social groups gradually included into the democratic process. Women in the West for example had to fight long and hard for their right to vote.

Nowadays it would not be acceptable for a government to grant democratic and voting rights to only some groups in society and not to others. In any modern democratic society today only universal suffrage would be acceptable. However in order for any new democracy with universal suffrage to be successful, surely the right social and economic conditions have to be put in place first.

As for Malnoh’s point about “what Chinese have done to themselves”, this applies above all, I would say, to the traitorous crimes that Chiang Kai Shek and his Nationalist Party perpetrated against China and her people. It is this that many Chinese, and I for one, cannot forgive. Chiang Kai Shek, the American puppet, fought against the Communists instead of against the Japanese occupiers and undermined the Communists' resistance efforts against the Japanese. He and his Nationalist Party then fled to Taiwan where they built their "new society" with funds expropriated from China without any concern whatsoever as to the consequences to China or to the lives and welfare of her people.

For those reasons alone, in my opinion, the Chinese government has the moral authority to insist on the eventual repatriation of Taiwan to China. In the same way that China had a legal and moral claim to the repatriation of Hong Kong given that the unequal treaties extracted from China “at the barrel of a gun” by the British by which the islands were ceded to Britain had no moral or legal basis. In the historical context it could be argued that China’s policy towards Taiwan is not unreasonable but understandable. The question now is: will the USA once more force China into another unnecessary war, this time over Taiwan? I hope not.

I realise that these views may not be popular with some Hong Kong Chinese or Taiwanese, or even amongst some mainland Chinese for that matter, many of whom have their own strong points of view about these matters.

As for Malnoh’s statement that Chinese Nationalism should only be expressed in Chinese. Does Malnoh believe that this should apply to all nationalities or only to some? In any event this is preposterous and any reasonable person would agree that it is contrary to the principle of freedom of speech and expression.

I would remind Malnoh that not all Chinese, especially those educated outside of China, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, etc., had the opportunity to study their native language and therefore are restricted as to what language they use.

GweiLo · Joined: 22 Feb 2004 Posts: 149

Unity
"I do not happen to be a member of the CNA."

As I said, it did not occur to me that you might be. But after malnoh mentioned it I realised that your comment "A "gweilo" lecturing others on racism, that's rich." might indicate that you were. Perhaps you didn't intend it that way but it is racist to suggest that white people have less right to challenge racism than others.

" Even if I was, would that in your minds discredit whatever I say?"
Erm, yes probably. Much of what I have seen on that site is racist and as I have already told you I don't like racists. I dislike chinese racists just as much as white ones. If you were comfortable being a member of such a site I would find it very difficult to accept that you did not support or condone the extreme views represented on it.

The remainder of your post is not aimed at me as I have not discussed any of those things, so I will leave it to malnoh to address other matters. In any event it is drawing this thread away from the question that lyllee asked, whether intentionally or not, so I'd rather not encourage it.

I'd be happy to discuss those issues on another thread however.

I still wonder whether we will get an answer from kapai.

unity97 · Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 10

The following is an article in today's paper by a survivor of the japs' invasion and occupation of China during the second world war :

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200407/07/eng20040707_148809.html

unity97 · Joined: 06 May 2004 Posts: 10

Here's an interesting news article in today's paper on 'modern' japan, that model of 'democracy' in Asia...

"JAPAN'S TEACHERS UP IN ARMS OVER WARTIME SYMBOLS

Those who refuse to sing 'Kimigayo' anthem or stand before Rising Sun flag have been sent to re-education seminars.

TOKYO - Ms Hiroko Arai, 59, is a mild-mannered, conservatively dressed English teacher at the Komatsugawa high school in eastern Tokyo.

She presides over classes where well-behaved children never display the rebellious attitudes said to be plaguing Japan's education system.

Now, Ms Arai feels she might teach her students a bit of rebellion herself.

The issue that stirred her to action is provoking deep anger among teachers.

This year, a new Tokyo school board directive required teachers to stand in front of a Rising Sun flag and sing the five-line 'Kimigayo' national anthem at school events.

Ideally, the directive says, one member of the staff should learn to play the anthem, whose title means 'His Majesty's Reign', on the piano.

By this July, more than 200 teachers had been officially reprimanded for failing to obey. Some were dismissed or had their pay and bonuses docked.

On Monday, dozens of teachers, including Ms Arai, were obliged to attend a closed-door 're-education seminar' where they were lectured for failing to obey instructions.

Some have described the seminars as an exercise in thought control.

'During the Second World War, the Hinomaru flag and the Kimigayo became symbols of what we did in the rest of Asia. I can't show respect to these symbols,' said Ms Arai.

'Even worse, I was told I would be punished if I did not stand.'

The rebellion by teachers, who say they represent a silent majority bullied into quiet compliance, comes against a background of what some claim is a tide of rising nationalism in Japan.

In 1999, Parliament granted official status to the Hinomaru and Kimigayo, which for years were rarely aired in public because of their association with Japan's wartime aggression.

Some teachers regard Japan's new-found fondness for its imperial symbols as part of a movement to brainwash a younger generation whose knowledge of Japan's past is scanty at best.

It is in Tokyo, whose governor Shintaro Ishihara is a prominent nationalist, where the new rules have been most stringently enforced.

Mr Ishihara, who has defended Japan's imperialist adventures as acts of liberation from European colonisers, has supported punishment of teachers, saying: 'As educators, they should abide by the rules set by the state and the metropolitan government. Following the rules itself is a part of education.'

Those who attended the re-education seminars said teachers were forced to sit close together in the centre of a large hall surrounded by guards and officials who noted their behaviour on forms.

Curiously, they added, lecturers never mentioned the flag or national anthem but concentrated on the punishments that could ensue if rules were flouted. -- Financial Times

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/asia/story/0,4386,266606,00.html?

Newsfeeds

Latest Posts

	Dimsum Forum Index -> Notice Board and Events	All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Page 1 of 1